NLP & Sales, NLP for Selling - Chat Transcript

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NLP & Sales

IRC Chat Log, May 27, 1998

NLP & Sales
Jonathan Who here's excited? As opposed to who wants to be?
follie, MichaelR_, Guest6637, finter, ORIgami, follie, Stefan Me!
Jonathan Welcome to tonight's chat on NLP and Sales. We're gathered here tonight to enjoy a discussion on using and applying NLP Techniques (Neuro-Linguistic Programming), as well as NLP information and NLP Skills to selling, sales, wealth-building, closing deals, and making money. Who here DOES Sales of some kind for a living? Or has done Sales in their past, or is curious about how to make Sales easy for themselves?
MichaelR_ In the past, I have.
follie I sell dreams.
Guest6637 I have. Mainly furniture.
Stefan I've just sold myself, ehmm, my services. If getting summer nice summer jobs counts.
finter I've sold Kirby Vacuum Cleaners
Jonathan WOW -- Kirby! A real Door-to-Door salesman! OK. I'd like to share a story with you! I do a lot of bookstore Talks at Borders Bookstores, some of you may know that. [editor's note: this was true from 1997-1999].
Guest6637 Now I'm trying to improve my skills for a MLM I am involved with.
Jonathan And I do my best to sell a few NLP books for the bookstores when I do! And I always bring NLP products of some kind with me to the bookstores. And I do different things with different groups, to gauge their differing reactions and see what works and what doesn't. One high level observation is that when some people buy, many people buy. If one or two buys, that's usually it. So when I'm selling to a group... there's something I do differently which makes the difference between several, and big #'s. Because there's a principle behind group responses. It's like... peer pressure. You do something successful... you induce the states... and people flock to the product I'm showing. But let me tell you the differences more concretely. If I talk about great things at the bookstore, and it goes on 5 minutes too long, everyone starts to tire (you can see the moment when the group begins to wane). And if that happens, I'd better have a closing right there. But if I keep inducing better states, and leading people through various discoveries... they get those AHA moments, and they begin to attach the continued AHA feelings... to guess who?
Tranzpupy You!
Jonathan Once I get that response... I have to take that moment to involve the product! And the product in the case of the bookstore talks is either tapes, or goods, or... seminars. The question is, once they feel that good, from just an hour... how good do they want to feel? Do they want more? And more & more & more of the discoveries they're making while guided by me? If they do, then they buy. Now if they don't, then I didn't induce the state. Now there's a difference between logical responses.... and emotional responses.

Do we buy what we Need or what we Want?
Jonathan Most sales are made at a given moment based on emotional, though most sales are made based on logical presuppositions. Very few people buy a house as an impulse buy, you know? There aren't house-closing deals hanging on the shelf at WALMART on the way out!!! So there's a big element of "is what I'm considering something I want?" Rather than if its what they need. OK lets jump into that for a moment! What percentage of the things you buy in life... do you think you actually "need?"
Guest6637 Very little.
MichaelR_ Very few, under 3% I'd say.
follie I find I need to get rid of a lot of the "things" I wanted at some time in the past.
Jonathan Does everyone else agree? Think about it! That's something to take and run with! Some tiny percentage of the things we buy in life we actually need. So that leaves the vast majority of things we buy in life... to be things we just want, and get some benefit from.
follie Right on, Jonathan
Jonathan So out of all the things we buy in life that we just want... what percentage of things that we buy... do we get value from?
Guest6637 I think we'll get some value from everything we buy. Or at least we think we will.
MichaelR_ In some way everything...after all...we are satisfying some desire by initiating the purchase. I think the issue is whether the value is temporary or sustained.
Tranzpupy I'm pleasantly surprised when I really enjoy something I bought more than I thought I would..
Jonathan Yes. This leaves us with the following: Some great percentage of the things we buy and sell are things people want and not need. If you fill a niche of things people need, and can fill demand.... your business will often be self-generating. But the question is, when you're selling something that provides some value... whether actual OR perceived... what methodologies can you utilize to maximize sales... and what things can we avoid!
follie My question exactly
Jonathan And where is the difference between ACTUAL and PERCEIVED values going to benefit us... and where is it going to harm us as salespeople? Let's start with intention. Because if your intention is to make a quick buck, there really are a lot of ways to do that. And sometimes, the thing you're selling is SO small, and has such wide distribution, that it almost doesn't really matter whether there's real value. If you can make people happy for a little while with the product... then... perceived value has been justified.
Tranzpupy Isn't making people happy an actual value?
Jonathan But most people who sell things don't have that kind of distribution web behind them... so they have to provide products that provide more value. Yes Tranzpupy! Because if Persuasion Engineering™ teaches us anything, we sell nothing but feelings. And my bookstore talks tell me the same thing.
Tranzpupy Mmm.
Jonathan I can talk until I'm blue in the face -- and talk about wonderful things... but when I'm not dynamic... when I'm not in state... I get 0, 1, or 2 tape sales at best.
Tranzpupy You gotta "go first"
Jonathan That's one of the neat things about NLP. Is that regardless of the state I'm in, I always have interesting material to talk about. And its provided useful experiments! Even if I'm not totally in an optimal state when I'm up there -- I can sense their interest in the material. But not their attachment to me! Does this make any sense? Because when you go into a state where you believe in your perceived value, and you amplify it with... a state where you BELIEVE IN YOUR ACTUAL VALUE as well.... PEOPLE will attach their emotional response to YOU! And when you get that response.... that's when you POINT TO your product!!!! And that's why when I get people SO juiced about improving their lives and communication with others... that I start talking about NLP training's Like, my seminars for example ;)
Tranzpupy You sly devil, you.
Jonathan Catch the language patterns? Language patterns help. But if the choice of words constitute only 8% of our communication -- I've found that far too much emphasis in NLP is on the choice of words and language patterns. Much more effective results come from understanding the process of communication and how it changes from moment to moment over time! In terms of when you.... open up your eyes... open up your ears... and pay attention differently with more clarity... to the signals people are giving you all the time. Be there with your sales prospects, completely. Forget the script. Pay attention to them, and be aware of what's going on with them. That's even more important 1-on-1! So I talked about how at the end of a bookstore talk, even if the information was golden, and I know they got it (because they go off to buy NLP books afterwards...) Unless I consistently paced the group and then led into consistently more positive and outrageous states, they didn't come up afterwards and sign up for events! But when I get them involved, they felt like it was their OWN thinking process and they created their own future possibilities all on their own. Does this make sense?
MichaelR_ Yes.
Jonathan I was called in to a Real Estate office recently. I've been doing some custom training work for an interesting real estate office nearby, and one of the managers brings me into deals occasionally. I'm like his secret weapon ;) the other guys never knew what hit em! They bring me in, and the guy they're talking to is just holding out for a better deal. But every day he waits costs him $5,000 in profits. He knows it too, and he thinks he can do better than those losses by waiting. And he doesn't know they have another offer on the table. They efforts to date haven't been able to close the deal. I went in... and I paid attention to what was going on. And I listened to the language... and I heard what this guy was saying... and watched what he was doing. And I mirrored him. Only I took what he was doing further. He had his arms crossed... on his side of the table... I was off to the side of the real estate guys on their side of the table... and I sidled off even further. I mean, I almost disengaged from the meeting. And I mirrored his arms and started looking over at MY clients, annoyed. I knew that they thought it was doing them good to hold on to their little secret about the other deal on the table. And I knew they wanted it closed with this guy (other reasons). But they didn't want to pay him the extra money, partly because they knew he'd make money from the day they closed the deal! So I went over to the opposition's side, and asked the guys I was working for, "why aren't you telling him the whole story?!"
Tranzpupy What?!
Jonathan They looked at me like I was nuts... of course... I mean, I'd prepared them letting them know I might do some very weird things. So they went along with it for the time being. Reluctantly! Meanwhile the dynamic is changing.... The guy who walked in feeling like he was holding out had "won over" a guy from their team... who was doing his closing for him. I said "You have this other offer on the table, from someone you could call today. And why haven't you explained that to [name omitted] because ALL of us could just go home right now and enjoy a long martini and a swim knowing how much money we'll all be making tomorrow... but no, you guys have to have the upper hand in this. OK. Now, my guys' jaws are on the floor. So, their states anchored... not by ME, but by the other guy's reaction... which is now starting to make pictures of closing the deal successfully RIGHT THERE.... and realizing that if he doesn't move right there, they're going to offer the deal to someone else. And that state was achieved not in response to something the opposition was saying to him, but by his own thought process! Bingo. Instant propulsion system to close that night. WIN-WIN for everyone. And it took him less than 5 minutes to sign the deal, once I'd done that. And everyone was happy. Did I have to make anything up?
MichaelR_ You kind of played both parties motives off of each other.
Jonathan Agreed. Both parties had a potential win-win they couldn't see. Now. Think about it. I could have made more money for either side, rather than both. I knew both parties would benefit, and that both parties would lose out by waiting. I knew both parties would benefit from a rapid close. And it occurs to me that ALL it took to get the close was to sell the hold-out on the feelings of all the good things he'd get by closing now, and all the feelings of all the things he'd be missing by not moving forward. Also, all parties involved had ALREADY dealt with the pros and cons of having the deal go through. They'd already been through that. So there was no chance of any of them being sore about the closing. Maybe the deal would turn out long term to be a bad investment... but no one would look back on the closing as being a bad decision. Yes, you have to know your product. Yes, you have to know what the standard objections are, and be able to overcome them, but even better, to never have to overcome them. Do any of these stories ring bells with some of your past sales experiences? And if so... lets concisely share them (1 line summaries) and choose 1 or 2 to talk about as a group! Choose either successful ones or unsuccessful ones... we'll explore why they were either!
MichaelR_ Selling home alarm systems, we specifically made sure that all possible objections were addressed, before the close. Preferable before they were raised. Worked great. ;)
Jonathan OK! Let's take the Home Alarm Systems -- for a couple of reasons! You had a script! You knew the usual objections! Yes-- preferably you addressed the usual objections before other people raise them... so that internally... other people have a sense that feels like they have no objections. Even if they had the ones you raised yourself! Right?
MichaelR_ Yes. I raised them intentionally. ...and disposed of them, when they agreed it was the right thing to do. ;)
follie sounds good
Jonathan Did you go door-to-door? Or was this selling to {perhaps qualified} prospects?
MichaelR_ Both. I really enjoyed door to door.
Jonathan Hehheh -- a true cold caller. Some people get chills when they think of cold-calling anyone.
MichaelR_ Once you get in that mode, it's be more outgoing.
Jonathan I agree!
MichaelR_ I was ice cold about it. ;) But, then I realized how fun it was, being able to do something that others missed out on.
Jonathan Cold Calling is awesome when you... learn powerful tools for getting into state more consistently and more effectively.... nowwwwww!

Getting into States Effectively!
follie So how does one get into that state effectively, Jonathan?
Jonathan Alright lets look a little more closely about getting into STATE! Because if you can't manage your state better... then improving your close ratio is going to be hit and miss! Does it make sense why?
Guest6637 makes sense.
follie of course - if you don't feel good about yourself, you can't pass good feelings on to your potential customer
Jazz- people can sense incongruency
Jonathan Yes Jazz! OK. So getting into state is not a problem when you have the tools. When you have the tools. You have the tools already. They're all inside you already! Basic NLP Presupposition: Everyone has all the resources they need already inside them. These resources are emotional states which you've experienced before, at one time or another. If you've experienced them before, then you can regain direct access to those states... because the body can remember what it was like to be in those states. Now. Think of a state you think would be useful for making/closing sales. Something like, Charismatic! Or Eloquent! Or Calm!
Guest6637 Powerful.
Tranzpupy Charming.
MichaelR_ A congruous a peak sexual state... ;)
Jonathan Whatever you choose. They're all useful. The more the better, too... if you have a wider variety of states... and can cycle through them faster... people see you as more dynamic. And their feelings for you will intensify! Take any or all of those you mentioned! Pick one, for now, if you're a little new to this. Now. What was it like, when you go back to the most powerful memory of when you had that state! See what you saw, hear what you heard, and feel what you felt then!
Tranzpupy As you practice, you learn how to change states faster...?
Jazz- I smell an anchor...
Guest6637 This is where I run into problems.
Jonathan This one's just about being more able to... DO these things... and feel better & better as you make more & more sales! OK, this is where you ran into problems... how so?
Jazz- The more you practice attaining these states, the more you realize just how easy it is to sell SELL sell
Guest6637 I can sometimes think of the time. but I don't always bring back the state.
Jonathan OK. For each person, Guest6637, the process can be quite different. And you don't always bring back the state.
Tranzpupy Me too
Guest6637 I'm Paul.
Jonathan OK, I'll use your name then, Paul ;) For some people, they'll go thru pictures first, or sounds... or feelings first, and then intensify with pictures or sounds... But whatever works for you works for you.
Guest6637 I think it's more like I don't really remember. It's like if someone where to ask you what...
Jonathan If you go back to a memory, and attempt to access the feelings but they're not there... it just means a number of possibilities:
(1) The memory has been divested of its emotional intensity through the process of remembering it in a variety of other circumstances... you're basically diluting the emotional response somewhat as that happens.
(2) You haven't yet found your ideal strategy for recalling the feelings
(3) You don't really remember.
Guest6637 You had for dinner last Tuesday. You know you ate, but you don't remember what.
Tranzpupy Or not
Jonathan So then the trick for you is to continue to seek out resourceful memories where its the strongest example you can recall of that particular resource. If you spend a while searching, with no result, then STOP! And do something different!
Guest6637 Like what?
Jonathan Start to search for a different resource... one which your unconscious mind is willing to offer up to you with more vigor and pleasure and clarity.
Tranzpupy Sometimes its like when I'm in a good, resourceful state, I can't think of those that aren't
Jonathan Anything positive and dynamic and energetic is a good sales state to be in, for starters.
Tranzpupy And sometimes versa vice...
Jonathan Using NLP and related techniques... you can get very flexible and sophisticated combining states... adjusting the intensity of states in combination with each other.... but for starters.... just think about gaining some flexibility with one at a time! If one state doesn't come easily... laugh about it.. and go in search of another kind of state where the memory might come back easier.
follie By flexibility, do you mean going in and out of that state at will?
Tranzpupy You mean being able to bring up one state, consistently?
Jonathan Yes to both! Lets talk about how to improve your speed and flexibility with states!

How Do We Gain Speed & Flexibility with State Changes for Sales?
Jonathan Let's start with some cross-crawling exercises designed to maximize your whole brain cross-hemispheric communication! Tune up your brain!
follie Say what?
Jonathan Example of cross crawling exercise: Point your fingers together in front of you (index-fingertips touching) and draw opposite-path circles in the air. I.e.: Both hands start together at the top of a circle oriented vertically... where the plane of the circle is parallel to your nose And while one hand traces the circumference of the circle clockwise... the other traces it counterclockwise... and both fingertips meet at the top of the circle and at the bottom of the circle...
Guest6637 Man.. that is hard!!
Jonathan I.E. they don't move in the same direction around the circle but in different places.... they move in different directions around the circle and touch tips twice (top & bottom)
Jazz- Wow.. trippy
Jonathan ;) Now reverse directions LOL Bwa hahahahahaha
follie Kinda like patting your head and rubbing your tummy :-)
Jonathan Yep! That works too!
Guest6637 So what will this achieve. I mean besides running me crazy. :-)
Jonathan So these kinds of exercises are GREAT brain tune-ups. It makes accessing information easier in the brain because it increases whole-brain activity! ESPECIALLY if you happen to systematically think about visual things... then auditory things.. then feelings... as you do those exercises! And move around from one primary sensory system to another during the exercises!
Tranzpupy When I show people that... they say, "Oh, that's easy." Then they try it! And say, "oh, that's hard!" Think and twirl in different directions at the same time?!!!
Jonathan Here's something else for making accessing easier: Nutrition for the brain! Supplements that provide brain-fuel! Like...
Tranzpupy Beer!
Rekaway Boone's Farm Strawberry Wine?
follie Chocolate!
Jonathan Choline Chloride, DMAE, Gingko Biloba, Phosphatidyl Serine.... I'm not proposing you go out and just use this stuff without reading how they work within an overall balanced nutritional supplement program. Phosphatidyl Serine is relatively new -- its a different form of Lecithin. All of the above is quite necessary for the brain, and you can get them in the USA at any good health food store.
follie How about St. John's Wort - or is that a different kind of brain food?
Jonathan St. John's Wort can be very euphoric. I've known some people "diagnosed" by medical professionals as "Manic Depressives" who started taking the maximum recommended dose of St. John's Wort, and half their problems disappeared. That's a bit facetious of course, but the point is, they felt their lives improved with a more consistent nutrition & supplementation plan. Look into it. That isn't a prescription of any kind. I recommend knowledge more than anything else. I have heard a lot of Law students take Choline Chloride and DMAE to help improve their memory for studying.
Rekaway Ummm... given the lawyers I deal with, that is no endorsement!
Jonathan Ideally, we wouldn't need any such supplements; our diets perhaps ought to be optimized, yet we're human and we like variety. So a good supplement program that is designed by a nutritionalist for your body chemistry is the smart way to go. Perhaps check with a doctor about the benefits of the above supplements. OK -- enough on supplements -- I'm getting off topic.
All of the above was designed to provide some ideas on how to optimize our behavior in sales situations... and to be really flexible with knowing how to get into positive states.... requires paying close attention to what our prospects are telling us with every move of their bodies, every blink of their eyes! And use that information to guide them dynamically to recognition of the value of your products! And maximizing the quality and effectiveness of your brain!
Alright! Lets recap here! When you can induce powerful emotional states.... and do it in a consistent fashion that takes into account the customer's needs and leads them to recognition of how good they'll feel after they've bought your product... or service..... Then attach all those good feelings to you and your product/service.... you'll maximize the effectiveness of whatever sales training you've acquired anywhere else. Here's the trick: There are many different big bulky sales methodologies. And some of them take months to learn. I don't teach those. Especially not in 1 day. I teach people to utilize specific techniques in NLP for inducing amazing states, creating triggers for those states... and attaching that trigger to you and your products.
But before we're done thinking about all that.... I want you to think about this: If all of your usual huffing... and all of your usual puffing... fail to make the sale appear really attractive to a prospect... and you're unable to overcome objections.... Some people might realize that with some NLP Techniques... you could actually overcome those objections long enough to make a quick sale. And I say, STOP. And ask yourself, "is it really worth the state I have to get into in order to be willing to get them to go against their own values?" Ask yourself "is it really worth the likelihood of them developing Buyer's Remorse and giving me a bad reputation?" Ask yourself "is it really worth the lack of self-respect I'll be developing?" And as you think about that, think about this: The only sale that's worth making.... is a WIN-WIN sale.


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