Chat Log: Design Human Engineering(TM) with John La Valle!
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President of the Society of NLP™
Master Trainer of NLP™
Richard Bandler's co-trainer in the USA
Co-Author of Persuasion Engineering.
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"Your Brain Works Faster than you Think" is ® John La Valle.
| Jonathan | I'm pleased to announce the start of the chat! Thanks to all of you for coming! And most importantly, I'd like to thank John La Valle for taking time out of his busy schedule... right on the heels of the Los Angeles trainings... to spend some time here with us!!!! Welcome! What a treat!
| PureNLP | Thanks! Good to be here.
| MetaMAN | *clapping*
| Jonathan | Fantastic. We had a number of topics we were mulling over, but most of the folks that I'd asked in earlier chats (after I knew you'd agreed....) wanted to hear a lot about DHE™!
| PureNLP | Oky Doky, will answer what I can.
| Jonathan | Sounds great! Well... I'm going to start off by asking a little basic DHE™ history. Right off the bat -- when did DHE™ come along by comparison to NLP?
| PureNLP | Well, it's hard to say, ya know, because Richard has been developing so many things all along. But just for history's sake, let's say it was about 1988-89. I know there's someone who's going to ask the difference, so, to understand, it's also difficult to discern the difference when it basically stems from one guy involved in the development of both. There are differences, though. Some of the ones are: NLP was remedial; DHE™ is generative in every sense of the word.
| Jonathan | Should we wait until later to explore that one?
| PureNLP | Sense. NLP uses strategies that are sequential. DHE™ uses simultaneous installation strategies and defies old beliefs about building NEW feelings... ones not experienced, yet. NLP is based on observations... DHE™ is based on CALCULATIONS.
| Jonathan | Interesting. Now... Phoenix has a GREAT question that would be useful here... "How far has DHE™ come since the DHE™ tapes..." Can you describe a little about the EVOLUTION of DHE™. How has DHE™ evolved since the tapes came out, if at all...
| PureNLP | How has DHE™ evolved?
| Jonathan | Yes.
| PureNLP | If it hasn't, then it isn't doing what it was designed to do, be recursive in continuous improvement for people as well as for the technology itself. Too bad people continue to wait before actually going to a seminar because by the time they finally decide, they want to learn what's already old and then they want to learn everything. I know many people think it's a put on, but I can tell you, it's not.
| Jonathan | I agree! Alright... This one comes from Ross: "Why is it important to think in terms of directions instead of OUTCOMES? Isn't it important that people keep their outcomes in mind in order to get them?"
| PureNLP | Outcomes limit and chunk down, OK for therapy. We don't do therapy. Don't even approve of it! Directions will take resources and propel them through futures and other (language) ideas and installations will permeate the neurological system in ways that are permanent.
| Jonathan | In a moment I'm going to turn the whole floor over to our guest of honor... and let him lead the channel... And I'd like to do this over the topic of what exactly or is the nature of DHE™?
| PureNLP | Actually, DHE™ has no nature unto itself; it's just another nominalization for building new things. I like RB's (of course, I'm slightly biased) "The territory is the map" (c)rbandler. You've got to consider a few things. "What" we have today didn't exist at one time. They started as an idea in someone's mind.
| Jonathan | Makes sense...
| PureNLP | Now, look at what's been developed over the years. I go into companies and tell them the 2 biggest excuses people can have really didn't exist: Time & $$. We made them up. Now, they exist(?). That keyboard you are all using was just an idea in someone's mind. Now look in front of yourself. See it? Not to mention the screen and all those little "post-It®" notes!
| Jonathan | Sure, there it is...
| PureNLP | These things were just ideas; Now looky at what we have! But those are just the material things.
| Jonathan | Agreed.
| PureNLP | What about the people in the darkest parts of the world that can regenerate fingers? Including joints? And where the creativity comes in is, hey, just think, if they can do that, why not build in a gold or diamond finder into that finger tip? Or women. I personally haven't found too many places where NLP people are remembering that "linguistics" is our middle name. And so, since it's what we have to work with in using our brains, we for-sure add this to the skills development parts of DHE™. Language skills, that is. It's what we use most to run our brains. Then there are resources. In NLP we have taught that all the resources are inside yourself, and that's true, but what about "new" ones? Are they really new? Or do we not access the mechanism to create new resources that already there? The mechanism, that is. That's the one resource that most people don't use. They chunk down way too far for something and then forget to chunk up to where it can be even more useful. We want people to build inside themselves those "strategies", where they are getting better and better each and everyday at whatever it is they want to be better at... based on "feedback loops" that either already exist, or that they can build. I'd like to open it up for questions. I'll be difficult at first, but if we follow these guidleines, it'll work out much better. If you already have DHE™ experience, please hold your questions, because there are many out there who have questions, and I'd prefer to answer those first, you understand. It'll be difficult at first, not me :)) Those without experience who have questions?
| Jonathan | Hyperbond Asked: "Where do you see the technology going in 5 years?"
| PureNLP | Why limit it to 5 years? People who have been trained are developing each and everyday -- new ideas -- new strategies -- new ways of communicating (telepathy) -- etc etc. If I knew where it'd be in 5 years, it'd be there now.
| Jonathan | Dan26 asked: "in the DHE™ model, are "new" resources analogous to natural resources buried in the earth that we must develop new tools for discovering, so that they are already there lying dormant waiting to be discovered and utilized?"
| PureNLP | Dan26, in some cases, yes. There are many places to look. You can develop internal tools from external ones, like, how about a built in compass so you know what direction you're going in, each and every moment of your life?
| Jonathan | Hyperbond has a great one: "Could you please give *examples* of the three most useful applications you can think of DHE™ having in enhancing someone's skills?"
| PureNLP | Sure, we had 3 guys who called one day after the Meta Master Track in Austin (did some DHE™, of course) and they called to complain. 1 had $15,000 show up in his business that he wasn't planning on. The other 2 were getting psychic info that was dead nuts on the money! Their complaint was, how come they didn't realize it would happen? Because they had it on their minds when they were building in things! What'd they think, that we just work on outcomes? They love it and it hasn't stopped for them! Now they get to adjust their mechanisms. So they have more control over them. DHE™ is also about having conscious control over your unconscious processes in a way that enables you to make the changes you want continuously.
| Jonathan | Pouch asked: "In terms of overall effectiveness as generative tools, are DHE™ "hallucinations" and "devices" equally useful in somnambulistic states as well as deep trances?"
| PureNLP | Of course, but where will you have more conscious control? These "devices" are just a way to get somewhere. Believe me, as soon as I figure it out, I'm teleporting and getting rid of the car! Hey I can visit you guys, one at a time instead of out here :-)) on the Internut! It's just a way of getting better control at first.
| Jonathan | Benzene has a good one: "DHE™ seems so chunked up, are there any specific techniques or is DHE™ just a whole new way of thinking?"
| PureNLP | Hey Benzene, it's a whole new way of thinking and while using what you already have, and then some. I know that some people are thinking and asking and commenting about DHE™ being too chunked up, and not enough specifics, that's because we, at costs, avoid nominalizing the processes. Otherwise, they will generalize too soon for what they're worth. Get used to it. People who have learned about it are blown away. That's why they can't explain it out there. Hell, most people can't even explain NLP. Nominalizations, remember? Too many people want to learn "something" but they forget that learning is a continuous process each and everyday, individually. And so, it's difficult to describe in detail. If you were to come to seminar of mine, I would want to know what's on your mind, in it, and alongside of it, so I could design the program right there, for the people who are there. People ask, well what's on the agenda? I don't know because I don't know who's there, but open your mind, ask some questions, tell me what you want to do and we're off and running. I had to build in a machine for that, just ask those who have been in the seminar room with me. Be careful what you ask for though. It's important... to be able to have access to your own resources, whenever, wherever you'll need/want them. Multitasking is very very useful everyday in your own mind.
| RossJ | It seems to me that "psychic experiences" and "abilities" are almost a byproduct of DHE™ training... was Richard trying to "sneak up" on folks, knowing that they'd have these experiences as a by-product of DHE™ training? So, rather than tell them that or promise them that..let them discover there are all sorts of experiences they can have that they didn't expect or existed outside of their belief structures?
| PureNLP | Well, Richard always tests things well before he presents them, for sure. Why set up expectations?
| Jonathan | I'm laughing; I love watching that!
| PureNLP | There are so many beliefs that can be opened, put aside, blown away, especially when it isn't expected. You can't argue with your own experience.
| RossJ | Ha! Brilliant of the Boss! Because once they learn there is so much more than they could expect...what they want to design in will change as well...keeps feeding back...go beyond expectations...to change what you want to design..which leads to going further beyond... which leads to further changing what you want to design... Unbelievable feed forward and back loop!
| PureNLP | That's why experience is the best way "towards" understanding! LOL!
| Jonathan | By the time anything is presented.... people already have the experience of having gone through it in their minds... even if not completely consciously accessible, but often so.
| RossJ | That seems to me to be the heart of Richard's genius in DHE™ and what he's really attempting to give to people..not the individual cool "Devices" that folks get fixated on "binoculars," "x-ray glasses" etc
| PureNLP | Those are just the toys. If you can do that, just imagine what else is possible for you!
| RossJ | The finger pointing at the moon, not the moon itself...
| PureNLP | Yeah! Hey, how come you understand? Too much Speed Seduction! LOL
| Jonathan | I knows Ross took a DHE™ training.... (oops! letting the cat out of the bag!)
| _Stile_ | He's been to rex sikes' training :)
| PureNLP | Hey, no advertising here, we are accused of that already.
| RossJ | Uh... well... I always chunk up and ask, "What is Richard really attempting to do as he distracts us with something that we THINK it is really all about?"
| PureNLP | Ross, that works.
| RossJ | That's my way of understanding him... he leads us by what we can accept all the while sneaking in the real magic... and all the while the dimwits are thinking the distractions are the heart of it... never realizing just what a gift he is giving people....
| PureNLP | Real magic?
| Jonathan | Not really dimwits ;) lets give people credit for being amazing learning machines....
| PureNLP | ROFL
| RossJ | Taking people beyond what they expected so they can then ask, "What do I want to design in now?" Jon: they are dimwits IMHO
| PureNLP | He's been doing it for years
| Jonathan | OK... I think we're reaching another stage... I'd like to take this in another direction if that would be OK!
| PureNLP | Sure.
| Jonathan | I'd like to explore a little more meat & potatoes! (hey Honey? Can you bring somma doze meat & potatoes over here?)
| PureNLP | Me, too!
| Jonathan | What I mean is that... DHE™ is about chunking up and designing in new things... and I know that it takes several Days to get trained in DHE™... so I'm not expecting to be a DHE™ expert in another hour...
| PureNLP | Good, me either! Still working on it!
| Jonathan | But if there were a couple of things I could do & explore... right here right now... to at least get some tangible feel for what I'm working with here... where might we start?
| PureNLP | Well, again, it's difficult in this single media.
| Jonathan | I agree. I know its an "impoverished" communications mode.
| PureNLP | But, let's take a look at those control panels everybody seems to know something about. Would that work? That way people can leave here with a little more meat. (sorry Tony)
| Jonathan | Yes! What's up 1st?
| PureNLP | OK - control panels
| RossJ | Do the dials go clockwise or counterclockwise? That's important, right?
| PureNLP | We have people build at first an easy control panel
| Jonathan | OK lets keep it simple & StraightForward
| PureNLP | It's not about some hokey thing replacing Sick-Step-Reframing, as has been assumed by some. It's about teaching your brain to have more precise control over your submodalities in ways that you haven't, so that you can build new ones. It's also a way of changing, building, enhancing, developing, new synesthesias.
| Jonathan | OK, can we do a quick submodality definition? I know thats reaallly basic, but...
| PureNLP | Sure, give'm a quick definition, jon
| Jonathan | Modalities = Representational Systems, Visual, Auditory, Kinesthetic (feelings), Gustatory (taste), & Olfactory (smell). Sub-Modalities = the *qualities* of each of those modalities. Like for visual -- brightness, location, size, shape, clarity, etc. You can change these things to alter your sensory experiences, etc. More on Submodalities can be found in... the "Insider's Guide to Submodalities" and in "Using Your Brain.... For a Change."
| PureNLP | Well, it's not enough to just understand SMD's. As soon as we get to that, people go, 'Oh, I know that, already.' That tells me they don't know how to use them. Because if they did, they'd go, "OK, so what's new here?" and open some new windows to understanding. Just imagine, if you could manipulate your own SMD's, in ways that could run all possible combinations across all modalities, then you'be be one hell of a creative machine. All too often people want to know that they understand what they already understand instaed of going into the "new" places. Now using these control panels, gives you a way to directly change each SMD, and actually, now get this, because people all too often want new "techniques" things they can explain. Using these control panels actually gives you a way of exercising your brain. Otherwise, how do you excerise it now?
| Jonathan | Yeah! How do I exercise it now! ;)
| PureNLP | Sure! Most people I meet say they too busy to remember what to do (with their NLP skills). I think to myself, why work so hard? How about integrating everything so you are NLP, instead of having to remember it? The control panels are explicit in the way that they give you to begin to design things. Gotta know how the ingredients work, first. Otherwise, you'll just remember that one recipe. If you know how the ingredients work, and under what conditions, then you can come up with your own recipes. Now, using the panels requires explicit steps. If you don't first learn to operate each submodality completely, then your brain won't learn how to use them with precision. Remember, precision is somewhat different than chunking down. While it uses the process of chunking down, it's different from what most people understand. Manipulating each SMD, starting with kinesthetics, then on to auditory, then to visual, one at a time, independently. Take 1 SMD, increase it all the way as far as you can, then decrease it the same, then put it back. Learn what your brain is capable of doing. Just this exercise alone will do great things for you!
| Jonathan | Tangram just asked a great relevant question! "Does John mean you spend a bunch of time exploring each in the context of a machine, or is he suggesting you learn your SMD abc's (or is that VAK's) before moving on to building with them?"
| PureNLP | Tangram, first take each one, and exercise each SMD in Kinesthetic, then do the same for Auditory, then Visual.
| Jonathan | MarcM asks "Can DHE™ be used to make internal visualizations more vivid, clear? And if it can, HOW?"
| PureNLP | MarcM, of course, it can, since you would take each SMD to the limits, but start with K first. Got it? If you do the K's really well, then the rest follows. Start with the K's, you know, from the old brain!
| Jonathan | MarcM asks "do some people have limits on clarity/vividness then?"
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